Autonomous Vehicles NOT Ready for Prime-Time

Non-Suzuki related topics. Anything can go here.
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Ronzuki
Posts: 2382
Joined: Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:33 pm
Location: Lancaster County, PA

Response from my brother to the above Forbes article (I censored the expletive's):

"This is exactly why we have so many ECM, TCM, BCM, you-name-it-CM issues. We can see the encrypted code and it blocks us, blocks our scanners. The only fix is a reflash or replacement (usually the case) depending on the bugs in the code. Now you know why I don’t want to buy a new car. Anything with a smart radio system is subject to this. Any car that can send a signal out can get F**KED. Signal out is essentially confirmation back and providing ‘whoever’ the green light for a reflash to occur. This is what hackers know and do. This can f**k every module in the car of which there are too many. Enjoy your Mazda!"

I can't tell you, literally I can't, the ungodly amount of time and money that is spent remedying these problems before these vehicles are cleared to the block for sale. Unfortunately, this all gets rolled back in to the price, and/or, the seller loses money, which then, negatively affects trade-in prices you are offered. See where all this BS is heading? You would most certainly not believe me if were able to tell you the dollar figures.

BTW, he still daily drives his early 2000s Trailblazer that he's maintained everything on himself since new. He wants a new vehicle, and really needs one, because it's at that age (and his as well) where it is simply turning in to a repair every couple weeks or so, minor and annoying stuff mostly, but needless to say....
Ron

2010 Kizashi GTS, CVT, iAWD (3/10 build date)
2011 SX4 Premium Hatch, CVT, iAWD (12/10 build date)
2018 Mazda CX-5 iAWD Touring
2014 Wrangler JKUW (GONE, traded :D :D )
1991 Samurai, 5-Speed, EFI, Soft-Top ( :| sold)
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KuroNekko
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Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 5:08 pm
Location: California, USA

Have your brother get a manual Kizashi. Reliable and simple yet nice to drive. Got the right amount of tech without all the unnecessary stuff, IMO.
:lol:
2011 Suzuki Kizashi Sport GTS 6MT (Black)
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Ronzuki
Posts: 2382
Joined: Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:33 pm
Location: Lancaster County, PA

He's a big dude...you should see him getting into and out of mine...it's comical. 6'-2" maybe and a solid 250ish. His head hits the roof because of the drop in the headliner for the sunroof.

It is note-worthy that I consider the Kizashi to be low-to-no tech anymore. There's a few things in there that can screw ya good should they fail, but the hackability aspect certainly isn't on the radar and it absolutely does not attempt to do any of the driving for me.
Ron

2010 Kizashi GTS, CVT, iAWD (3/10 build date)
2011 SX4 Premium Hatch, CVT, iAWD (12/10 build date)
2018 Mazda CX-5 iAWD Touring
2014 Wrangler JKUW (GONE, traded :D :D )
1991 Samurai, 5-Speed, EFI, Soft-Top ( :| sold)
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Ronzuki
Posts: 2382
Joined: Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:33 pm
Location: Lancaster County, PA

Distracted-Driver Assist Technology....FAIL...

Walter Huang, a 38-year-old Apple software engineer, was driving his Tesla Model X in Mountain View in autopilot mode at about 70 mph when it crashed into a safety barrier (while playing a game on his iPhone). Cool coder, dude.

https://www.foxbusiness.com/technology/ ... lot-issues
Ron

2010 Kizashi GTS, CVT, iAWD (3/10 build date)
2011 SX4 Premium Hatch, CVT, iAWD (12/10 build date)
2018 Mazda CX-5 iAWD Touring
2014 Wrangler JKUW (GONE, traded :D :D )
1991 Samurai, 5-Speed, EFI, Soft-Top ( :| sold)
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Ronzuki
Posts: 2382
Joined: Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:33 pm
Location: Lancaster County, PA

I haven't posted anything in here in quite a while :lol:
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Ron

2010 Kizashi GTS, CVT, iAWD (3/10 build date)
2011 SX4 Premium Hatch, CVT, iAWD (12/10 build date)
2018 Mazda CX-5 iAWD Touring
2014 Wrangler JKUW (GONE, traded :D :D )
1991 Samurai, 5-Speed, EFI, Soft-Top ( :| sold)
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KuroNekko
Posts: 5170
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 5:08 pm
Location: California, USA

Hey Ronzuki!
Hope you're doing well. I haven't been as active on the forum as in the past due to life's busyness and another Suzuki (V-Strom 650) taking up my time and attention.

Having recently drove a Tesla Model 3 and experienced Autopilot while seated in the driver's seat, I can attest to the fact that it's really an advanced cruise-control with gimmicks instead of being fully automated driving. I wouldn't trust this thing to drive itself much at all. This then again supports my argument: Is it really the technology at fault or those who misuse the technology with more trust and responsibilities than it was actually designed and intended to handle? It seems it's constantly human error in trusting this technology beyond its intended design.

I wish I had the time to really write out a "review" on the Model 3, but I can't find the time. To sum it up:
The drivetrain is amazing. Smooth and fast, the electric torque is a revelation easily proving that electric motors are the future of automobile propulsion. It accelerates with an urgency that you can't get with many gasoline cars unless you have the (expensive) ideal amount of power paired to the ideal transmission. Let off the throttle and you feel the biggest difference between an ICE and EV; the motor deceleration. It really can replace brake usage at low speeds.

The dash experience was predictably the mess I thought it would be. I hate the single center screen with no instrument cluster. I have to look to the right to even know my speed and enter submenus for core vehicle functions. It's not for driving enthusiasts who want that info up and ready under our nose.

Autopilot, at least the version in this Model 3 base model, is really not automated driving. You even tell it to change lanes with the activation of the turn signal stalk. It can easily miss exits if there are anomalies like construction or other factors. I can't imagine trusting this thing to drive itself as I fall asleep or watch a movie. That's user negligence and experiencing it myself proved this for myself. I think it's best for sludging through crawling traffic, not driving you around town.

Overall, the Tesla Model 3 is a convincing contender, but really, the only thing I really really liked was the drivetrain. Otherwise, whatever. I rather have the drivetrain in another car built better and with a traditional instrument cluster minus the Tesla gimmicks and nonsense. Also, having heard the stories of my friend running out of range short of the vehicle's calculations on longer drives or up a mountain, it showed me that PHEVs are still the better choice for anyone who regularly goes out of town and likes to adventure. I'd honestly take the new Toyota RAV4 Prime over a comparably priced Tesla Model 3 for these reasons.
2011 Suzuki Kizashi Sport GTS 6MT (Black)
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Ronzuki
Posts: 2382
Joined: Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:33 pm
Location: Lancaster County, PA

Howdy Kuro...
Doing well, staying bug free (social distancing is in my nature), and most importantly, still employed...for the time being. Things are just now starting to improve with large prospect quoting and the odd nickel/dime job trickling in here and there. And here we go again...the country /world locks down again, it's game over. We (my company) won't be able to survive another one.
KuroNekko wrote: Autopilot, at least the version in this Model 3 base model, is really not automated driving. You even tell it to change lanes with the activation of the turn signal stalk. It can easily miss exits if there are anomalies like construction or other factors. I can't imagine trusting this thing to drive itself as I fall asleep or watch a movie. That's user negligence and experiencing it myself proved this for myself. I think it's best for sludging through crawling traffic, not driving you around town.
Why is it the term "anomaly" always comes along in conjunction with the term "automated"? :roll: Your comment including the word sounds like one of the many daily BS 'our crap doesn't work' emails I get from Rockwell Automation. :lol: They produce tons of anomalies. :lol:

You'd be a fool to "trust" ANY automation.

All I'm going to say is there was an unexplained 'incident' at the auto auction involving a Tesla being moved on the lot which damaged quite a few cars including the Techno-mobile being operated manually (god forbid).
Ron

2010 Kizashi GTS, CVT, iAWD (3/10 build date)
2011 SX4 Premium Hatch, CVT, iAWD (12/10 build date)
2018 Mazda CX-5 iAWD Touring
2014 Wrangler JKUW (GONE, traded :D :D )
1991 Samurai, 5-Speed, EFI, Soft-Top ( :| sold)
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Ronzuki
Posts: 2382
Joined: Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:33 pm
Location: Lancaster County, PA

Thought I'd resurrect one of my favorite (not) automotive topics for some interesting banter.

My reaction to the following is obviously "You don't say?? :roll:

https://hotair.com/jazz-shaw/2022/09/13 ... le-n496158

I'd love to know just how many millions of dollars have been wasted to arrive at this painfully obvious conclusion?

Wonder if this realization has anything to do w/ the NASDAQ's stellar tanking today? :? nah, just a coincidence.
Ron

2010 Kizashi GTS, CVT, iAWD (3/10 build date)
2011 SX4 Premium Hatch, CVT, iAWD (12/10 build date)
2018 Mazda CX-5 iAWD Touring
2014 Wrangler JKUW (GONE, traded :D :D )
1991 Samurai, 5-Speed, EFI, Soft-Top ( :| sold)
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KuroNekko
Posts: 5170
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 5:08 pm
Location: California, USA

Autonomous driving vehicles are definitely making slow progress but to say they might be impossible is very shortsighted. It took just 66 years from the Wright Brothers taking first flight to NASA landing on the moon. What will happen if many automakers abandon autonomous driving R&D is that some companies will specialize in it and develop advanced systems far surpassing the technology of others. The price of the technology will then cost more but won't go away or be halted.

While autonomous vehicles have their own problems and are far from replacing human driving, I've always argued that humans are the bigger problem in traffic safety. Traffic fatalities are now at records levels and increased despite COVID-19 hampering work commutes and vacation travel.
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/05/17/us-traf ... -says.html

I just got back from a cross-country drive traveling again from Maryland to California. This time, it was in my father's 2004 VW Jetta TDI and we decided to drive through Mt. Rushmore, Yellowstone National Park, the Grand Tetons, and Zion National Park. The route ranged from interstate freeways with 80 MPH speed limits through Iowa's corn fields to snowy mountain passes in Wyoming at nearly 10K ft. in elevation. It rained very hard at times in Maryland, South Dakota, and California (surprise!). Some routes leading to and out of the national parks consisted of small two lane highways. Given the current fatal accident rate in this country, I definitely kept that in mind and drove carefully.
2011 Suzuki Kizashi Sport GTS 6MT (Black)
KlutzNinja
Posts: 286
Joined: Wed Dec 04, 2019 6:58 am



As amusing as it is unsettling.
Current: Blue 2018 Mazda 3 GT 5-Door
Previous: Blue 2010 Ford Focus SES,
Black 2013 Kizashi Sport GTS-L (CVT; FWD)(RIP)
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